Mini moto's

[AquilaEagle]

What's the legal position on them:

a) being ridden on pavements and footpaths?
b) being ridden on roads?
c) liability for any damage caused?

in all cases, whether by minors or adults

[snowman]

If they are a motorised vehicle, then presumably they are veiwed just like bikes and cars, and can be dealt with accordingly (?)

[noyourrights]

Fixed Penalties - Seizure of bikes by police
- The chance of being sued for injuries and/or criminal damage

Also, parents are responsible for fines and costs if a vehicle is seized from their child. The worst scenario is that a child or someone they collide with could be killed or seriously injured.

Mini Motos and similar vehicles can only be ridden legally on private land, with the owner's consent. Anyone breaking the law faces prosecution for having no road tax and insurance and, depending on their conduct, careless or dangerous driving.

If the rider is too young to drive, any penalty points handed out by the court will be kept on file and activated as soon as they are old enough to apply for a licence.

Youngsters who ride miniature vehicles on roads, pavements and car parks, putting pedestrians at risk, are breaking the law and are liable to have their treasured possession seized by police.

Several youths have been issued with warnings and police can seize these motorbikes under section 59 of the Police Reform Act. Owners would then need to pay a fine to recover their vehicle and may be subject to motoring offences. Anyone using one of these motorbikes on a public road must have a driving license, insurance, tax, MOT and index plates and also wear a helmet.

[AquilaEagle]

Thanks nyr :)

[noyourrights]

pleasure;)

there has also been cases of people ending up in court for driving whilst disqualified

they have previously lost thier licence through a motoring offence later they get caught riding a mini moto eg on the pavement.
the moto is classed as a motorised vehicle
the path is public highway

so they are driving whilst disq.:rolleyes:

[AquilaEagle]

This is what prompted my question:

http://www.s2ki.com/forums/index.php?showtopic=347740

:)

[noyourrights]

alot of anger over there on s2Ki:eek:

i can understand it a lad used to ride his goped up and down past the front of my house a chap that lives opposite asked him nicely to not keep riding up and down8)
a week later the "little scrote" came back beeping his horn outside the house opposite:mad:
so i opened the blinds and took his picture every time he whent past until he spotted me:eek:
next he sent his mate down (on the goped) to see if i was taking pictures so i took one of him too:rolleyes:

havent seen them since:D

[Hoon Devil]

For our local publicity campaign, the police took great delight in smashing one up with a sledgehammer to publicise their possible end if used on the public highway. Possibly they were too gentle with it.

[atte]

Read in the paper that two dogs have been killed by these things ridden by kids since xmas

[AquilaEagle]

alot of anger over there on s2Ki:eek:


LOL! not really, you have to know the personalities, and how they post :D

[KrisP]

Read in the paper that two dogs have been killed by these things ridden by kids since xmas

That's correct Atte

Two Lurchers were killed in Bradford on Avon, Wiltshire on Christmas Eve by two very young kids whilst the dogs owner was walking them on some fields. A very disturbing story.

A kid just down the road from me rode one down the footway and then onto the playing fields next to my house, surrounded by the usual hoards of screaming kids. He's only about 9 and had no control over the machine. His Dad is quite strict but I imagine he doesn't know about that little incident.

Avon & Somerset Police cut the chassis of the machines in half of those vehicles they confiscate.

Kris

[noyourrights]

it will be interesting to see what happens to the youngsters or thier parents

[Chris123]

Apparently (according to a parent interviewed on tv the other night), it is all the council's fault for not providing somewhere for their kid to ride the mini moto they bought him. :stupid: :bang:. Shallow end of the gene pool anyone?

Cheers

Chris

[AquilaEagle]

facking chavs!!!

[BillZZR]

The other side of the story is though.........If mum or dad, or in my case Uncle, or Aunt, has a "Mini Bike" designed for smaller children, but doesnt own a farm or large estate, or have access to a huge garden, then, where do you go to use them. I am talking about responsible, supervised use here, not leave the little darlings to get on with it on their own, with a "Play Nice" comment.

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v308/Billzzr600/puch_magnum_x_1979.jpg

My local Council provides at taxpayers expense, some very underused except at certain times of year running tracks sports pitches, BMX tracks, and skateboard bowls, even a radio controlled car track and plane runway facility, but if I were to take my Nephew or Neice to any of the above, and let them ride round (restricted to 15/20mph flat out wearing sensible protective clothing and a crash helmet unlike some of the BMXrs and Boarders) we are likely to fall foul of the local police.

So I dont, and my little bike (1979 49cc Puch Magnum X Single speed with centrifugal clutch, and throttle stop restricted) wastes away at my house, languishing in the garden shed, next door to the BMX track, and my Neices and nephews who visit, and want a shot on Uncle Bills Motorbike have to be told sorry you are too small to go on the Kawasaki, and no you can't go out on the mini bike either, unlike your older Cousins could, because it has become an anti social activity, in recent months and years. "Just play with your play station Grand Theft Auto and wait till you are 17 then you can terrorise the neighbourhood, in your pimped corsa", without any sense of throtle and machine control, braking distances, personal and public safety, and it can hurt if you get it wrong, being installed at an early age. And all because it has a petrol powered, not pedal Powered engine.

[AquilaEagle]

So don't buy one if you don't have anywhere to use it? :)

[BillZZR]

Ive had it since 1990, when there were no problems using it around where we live, sensibly,:) even in some public spaces, BUT NEVER ON A FOOTPATH OR ROAD!!!
It was a non Runner, when my brother in law and I got it so that we ....ooops.:oops: .... nephew could play on it, in my mums garden. Vegetable patch and compost heap motocross, washing line time trials etc :p It even used to get taken to the local Primary school Fete and raised money for the PTA by charging for spins round the playing field.
Mum has since moved, and my nephew is 23 and an honours graduate, but others have since arrived, and the little thing is still mechanicaly safe and sound.

My point was more that, even if I were to make aplication to the Local Authorities, to use it on for example the almost unused (except by alchohol fuelled herds of Hoodied teens) BMX track, even allowing for the fact that it has been restricted to the speed of a well pedalled bike, the attitude is much as the posts on the thread.......Public menace, NEDs Chavs, ASBO's etc and worse of all it has two wheels and will encourage Bikers to rampage through our parks and gardens, It is too noisey, etc etc (less intrusive than a petrol powered flymo high pitched shriek IMHO)

It is not the thing itself, it is the perception of it and the behaviour of the idiots who dont know how to use a thing sensibly, that make it what it seems to be.

Let us ban the use of all vehicles that produce more than 100Bhp because some nutters do burnouts and drag race around the loacal retail park, and drive too fast up and down the local Dual carriageway.......and every one who owns one should be given an ASBO.......I Think Not.

So it stays in the shed, unavailable to my dangerous 8 year old neice, once in a while, while visiting her Biker Uncle :(

[Hoon Devil]

Should you be letting them play Grand Theft Auto..? ;)

[noyourrights]

im with you on this one bill
it is not fair to bundle supervised sensible kids riding in a safe place in the same group as brain dead teens doing 50mph along a path or round a park full of toddlers

as youngsters we allways had an old bike to ride around a field usually a honda C90 i think the problem is every bit of spare ground has been built on and building a bike track wont win votes for your local council

[Hoon Devil]

That is a significant part of the problem - given the difficulty local authorities have with siting skateboard parks, making space for bike tracks is even less likely. It's certainly not a way to keep the electorate happy.

Having said that, there are a few privately owned tracks round here, I've no idea what they charge though.

[noyourrights]

just a thought Bill try contacting a local motoX club they usually have practice tracks and run sessions for youngsters for a small fee
there are loads of practise tracks advertised in the back of motorcross and trials news

[Masked Marauder]

The council can not open public land for mini-motos etc, because they are by definition a "Public Place" so the bike would have to be street legal and you would need insurance licence etc.

And BillZZR, you were using your bike in breach of the law even then. But as your not a Corsa driving chav does that make it OK?

[noyourrights]

i dont think drivers of vauxhall corsa's are in any way related to mini moto riders

[Chris123]

im with you on this one bill
it is not fair to bundle supervised sensible kids riding in a safe place in the same group as brain dead teens doing 50mph along a path or round a park full of toddlers
No arguements from me. Whilst slightly different, my first proper bike at age 17 was a Suzuki trail bike - riding it off road taught me a lot about machine control which stood me in excellent stead when I moved on to bigger / faster road bikes. Had I caused a nuisance to anyone my parents would have made sure it was a one off (age 17 or not!)

The attitude of the parents interviewed seemed to be very much "we've done our bit and bought the bike - not our problem any more" which seems to be an all too common parental attitude.

The attitude of one of the companies selling mini moto seems to be a bit less than helpful too - from http://www.minimoto.co.uk/faqs.html:


CAN I RIDE MY MINIMOTO ON THE PUBLIC HIGHWAY (ROAD)?
The official answer is no, but the law states that all that is necessary is any warning i.e.: horn/bell (the Law is vague here - see gopeds), Also most minimoto bike tyres are slicks - again breaking the Lawon the roads.
Though to be fair they do give info on racing/ places to go (mostly go kart tracks)

Cheers

Chris

[BillZZR]

The council can not open public land for mini-motos etc, because they are by definition a "Public Place" so the bike would have to be street legal and you would need insurance licence etc.

And BillZZR, you were using your bike in breach of the law even then. But as your not a Corsa driving chav does that make it OK?


I Know, and thats again one of the reasons it doesnt get used anymore.
I was just having a rant.
If it were to become a serious issue, and if the Kids were actually mine, then I would seriously think about kiddie MotoX, but the Expense that could incurr when the 1 neice and 1 nephew who are still small enough to ride the thing without looking like King Kong on it may not actually be that keen doesnt warrant it.

Also Like a lot of posts throw up on here, its now about the letter of the law, not the Spirit.

Some years ago, one evening during School Summer holiday times, whilst we were using it, I was very nicely spoken to by a Police Officer, who suggested that the Empty ground we were in (and used by locals to "walk the dog" etc but since sold by the Local Authority and now got lots of private houses on it) was a bit dangerous. Not because we were out with the then kids with a powered bike, but because It had been used as the Builders yard for the Neighbourhood when the new town was built, so probably had lumps of bricks, and bits of timber, old wheelbarrows etc embedded in the ground, and undergrowth. "Why dont you walk it round to the Primary School Playground, and use it there?.....they have it marked up with roads and crossings etc for the Cycling Profficiancy Scheme, (where did they go?) and you could teach them a bit about road safety while you are having fun"............HOW THINGS HAVE CHANGED!!!!!!:(

[AquilaEagle]

So don't buy one if you don't have anywhere to use it? :)I probably should have added, "or are not willing to pay to use it in a suitable location."

If I had a racing car, I'd pay to use it on a circuit, not drive it up and down a road, or round tesco car park. Same principle applies :) And if i didn't want to pay to use it on a circuit or considered it too expensive to do so, then I'd have no grounds to complain that my local council didn't provide a free racing circuit for me - or would I? :D